COVID 19 GLOBAL

[forcebwithu]

News for Indonesia isn't good. Note the article is an opinion piece and we've seen headlines before touting huge numbers of expected deaths when the reality ended up being quite a bit lower. Still, the article does point out how slow Indonesia has been to waking up to the fact this is serious, and enacting restrictions to control the spread of the virus.

Coronavirus is on the verge of exploding in Indonesia and 240,000 could die

Almost no-one thinks Indonesia is handling the COVID-19 pandemic well.

Until early March, the government claimed it had no cases of infection, something the eccentric health minister Terawan Agus Putranto attributed to prayer.

The Home Affairs Minister urged the public to eat more bean sprouts and broccoli, while President Joko Widodo (Jokowi) sang the praises of jamu, traditional herbal remedies.

The government had been in denial.

Terawan dismissed as "insulting" a report by Harvard University researchers saying Indonesia must have unreported cases. As recently as last Friday, another minister was still arguing the virus cannot survive in tropical climates.

Jokowi was apparently more concerned about the threat the virus posed to trade, investment and tourism.

In February, when many countries were imposing tough travel restrictions, he planned to offer discounts of up to 30 per cent to attract tourists. His government even allocated almost $8 million to pay social media influencers for tourism promotions.

On March 2, Indonesia finally acknowledged COVID-19 had reached the archipelago.

Jokowi admitted, as many suspected, his government had withheld information from the public "to avoid panic".

And then it finally began to act. The government banned mass gatherings, imposed so-called "large-scale social restrictions" and barred foreigners from entering the country.

It announced it will release 30,000 prisoners from the country's notoriously overcrowded and unhealthy prisons and will spend an additional $40 billion on medical needs, social support and relief for small and medium businesses

Last week, Jokowi even toyed with the idea of declaring a civil emergency (similar to martial law) before quickly backtracking.

...

[galenkia]

2108 recorded deaths in the US yesterday. 

What does it take for some members here to understand the reality of this situation. 

[Ivan the terrible]

1 minute ago, galenkia said:

2108 recorded deaths in the US yesterday. 

What does it take for some members here to understand the reality of this situation. 

[thegrogmonster]

Just now, galenkia said:

2108 recorded deaths in the US yesterday. 

What does it take for some members here to understand the reality of this situation. 

A close death I would imagine.   

I visit my mum regularly but she stays on her balcony and I am outside while we talk. I am still working and mixing with people and couldn't live with myself if I passed this onto someone.     

[galenkia]

Just now, thegrogmonster said:

A close death I would imagine.   

I visit my mum regularly but she stays on her balcony and I am outside while we talk. I am still working and mixing with people and couldn't live with myself if I passed this onto someone.     

If all of us had your common sense we could get this under control. 

I'm still working so it's hard to keep to social distancing so I'm staying indoors as much as possible and trying to stay away from my house mates.

[fforest]

....

Edited February 11, 2021 by fforest

[thegrogmonster]

9 minutes ago, galenkia said:

If all of us had your common sense we could get this under control. 

I'm still working so it's hard to keep to social distancing so I'm staying indoors as much as possible and trying to stay away from my house mates.

One thing I found hard to fathom was when a workmate came around last weekend to help me work on my car and people complained we shouldn't have done that. We have been spending the last couple of weeks sitting side by side all day in our work vehicle so we have no issues at all working together and realise if one of us get the virus then more than likely the other one will.

This is why I take so many precautions to stay far enough away from people that I only have brief contact with.

[coxyhog]

[Thai Spice]

30 minutes ago, forcebwithu said:

Jokowi admitted, as many suspected, his government had withheld information from the public "to avoid panic".

Yep, most people are fully aware of this.

Personally I agree with this approach. It is way better than having a counter and headlines permanently updated with the daily deaths etc.....

Indonesia has a population of 260 million, spread on 7,000 islands, with a rather low standard medical system.

People are dying, a lot. Although things are very different from one island / region / city to another. 

The Miss and family are all saying "why the government is only helping the people of Jakarta, and don't care about the rural areas ?"  Well the answer is easy, the government (and religious authorities) know that if things go south (big demo's) it will be in the capital.  In the rural areas people will die (like in any 3rd world rural area) quietly and without noice. No real statistics will be made. 

Next big question is if the government will ban the "mudik", traditional migration at the end of the Ramadan when people go back to their village to celebrate the end of the fasting.  For the moment nobody has dared to make a decision. I guess they wait to see what Saudi will do and then use that as justification. 

There is also an historical problem with Indonesian of Chinese origin, (Google is your friend) and nobody want to see a repeat of the riots of late 90's.

 

 

[galenkia]

1 minute ago, Thai Spice said:

Yep, most people are fully aware of this.

Personally I agree with this approach. It is way better than having a counter and headlines permanently updated with the daily deaths etc.....

 

 

 

Unless people know the full reality of this virus they will never take it seriously. 

And Wuhan has now reopened its wet markets again, the place where it all started 🙄

And probably still selling live bat's and pangolin. 

[Thai Spice]

9 minutes ago, galenkia said:

Unless people know the full reality of this virus they will never take it seriously

Do you think that the vast majority of small people have the education and intelligence to really understand this ?

I can see when in the village, nobody is watching the news or reading newspapers. The young generation takes their information from FB or Twitter. My Grab driver this morning "Corona will bankrupt Bali. In your country you have Corona also ?" 

Except for an educated minority most people see Corona only through the economic impact. 

Have a look on the numbers here, and the comment on the health system.

https://www.worldatlas.com/amp/articles/leading-causes-of-death-in-indonesia.html

There is also maybe a certain fatalisme in this (muslim) country regulary hit by tsunamis, volcanic eruptions and earthquakes  causing large numbers of deaths.

 

[galenkia]

9 minutes ago, Thai Spice said:

Do you think that the vast majority of small people have the education and intelligence to really understand this ?

I can see when in the village, nobody is watching the news or reading newspapers. The young generation takes their information from FB or Twitter. My Grab driver this morning "Corona will bankrupt Bali. In your country you have Corona also ?" 

Except for an educated minority most people see Corona only through the economic impact. 

Have a look on the numbers here, and the comment on the health system.

https://www.worldatlas.com/amp/articles/leading-causes-of-death-in-indonesia.html

There is also maybe a certain fatalisme in this (muslim) country regulary hit by tsunamis, volcanic eruptions and earthquakes  causing large numbers of deaths.

 

Afraid that is how Darwinism works, but unfortunately it also affects the educated. 

[Krapow]

1 hour ago, galenkia said:

2108 recorded deaths in the US yesterday. 

What does it take for some members here to understand the reality of this situation. 

And you were a proper sceptic about all this at the start.

[Krapow]

5 hours ago, Ivan the terrible said:

patent nonsense...AE depts have strict protocols about who is admitted...they dont have the bed availability to admit someone who is not seriously ill 

Spot on!

And that's 'normal' times, never mind now which is unprecedented. 

If anything, there is growing anger that people who are seriously ill with breathing difficulties due to coronavirus are dying at home as they CAN'T get admitted, even nurses. 

[galenkia]

10 minutes ago, Krapow said:

And you were a proper sceptic about all this at the start.

Never thought it would get this bad, but it shows how wrong you can be. 

[Krapow]

47 minutes ago, Thai Spice said:

Do you think that the vast majority of small people have the education and intelligence to really understand this ?

Judging by some of the responses on this thread, sadly no!

[Horizondave]

I have come to this thread and it made me think of making a Belgian 'waffle' but all I see is a Frenchman talking bollocks.

Seriously I would love to be on a beach blindly thinking this doesn't affect me but the reality is a lot of us here are being directly touched by this terrible virus. The time for recrimination and debate should surely come when looking back to see what could have been done better.  In the meantime this virus could be getting worse and hopefully the many friends and family we have will still be at the end of the phone when this is all over. That is my hope.

 

[Krapow]

1 minute ago, galenkia said:

Never thought it would get this bad, but it shows how wrong you can be. 

It's going to get worse before it gets better, at least in the UK. I knew April was going to be horrific for the UK, just don't know how horrific, especially London.

[fforest]

On 4/11/2020 at 4:32 PM, galenkia said:

Never thought it would get this bad, but it shows how wrong you can be. 

.....

Edited February 11, 2021 by fforest

[fygjam]

4 minutes ago, fforest said:

I agree I never thought I would see 100s of millions out of work and on their way go going broke and being homeless and losing businesses they have worked their whole life for all for a virus that so far 103,506 people didn't recover from.....

FIFY

[forcebwithu]

News report on subway usage in NYC.

A conundrum for New Yorkers: Social distancing in the subway

They let trains that look too crowded pass by. If they decide to board, they search for emptier cars to ride in. Then they size up fellow passengers before picking the safest spot they can find to sit or stand for commutes sometimes lasting an hour or more.

This quiet calculus is being performed daily by people who must keep working during the coronavirus pandemic and say the social distancing required is nearly impossible to practice in the enclosed spaces of New York City’s public transit system.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says that people should stay 6 feet (2 meters) apart. But even though ridership has plummeted in the city, making jam-packed trains and buses the exception rather than the rule, passengers aren’t always guaranteed even 6 inches (15 centimeters).
...
In London, where ridership is down as much as 93% from the same point last year, images posted on social media have shown some trains crowded at rush hour since fewer are running because of staff illnesses. Fourteen London transport staff have died from the virus, including eight bus drivers.

In New York, too, use of all forms of mass transit has plummeted.

Ridership on the subways Monday was down 92% compared to a normal weekday. The commuter rail lines serving Long Island had 97% fewer passengers. On Metro-North, which serves the city’s northern suburbs, including those in Connecticut, ridership was down 95%. On MTA buses, it is down more than 60%.

The agency has cut back bus service by about 25%, reduced the number of trains running on weekdays on the Long Island Rail Road from around 740 to around 500 and on Metro-North from 713 to 424.

While subways and buses are all far less crowded than normal, there are still moments that are too close for comfort in the age of coronavirus.
...
To keep trains from getting too crowded, New York’s MTA says it has sought to keep up normal service on the most-used routes. There are also police directing people on subway platforms to less crowded sections of trains. Riders are urged to cover their faces and to report situations where social distancing isn’t being observed.

The agency has posted signs on some trains that read: “Essential Worker, yes, ok to ride. … No — why are you even reading this? Go home.”
...

[Krapow]

Some good news, Spain just posted it's lowest number of deaths for 19 days, and infections also down.

The lockdown is working, as has been seen in Italy and elsewhere as well. 

Take time to filter through in the UK, though we can have hope. 

Though the Spanish are saying the numbers are likely to be much higher than reported, as like the UK, they're only counting those dying in hospital from Coronavirus. And they're scared of a 2nd wave should they 'open up' again too soon. 

[forcebwithu]

And a report on random sampling for COVID-19

COVID antibody test in German town shows 15 percent infection rate

This morning we have some data giving a little more insight into the great unknown of the coronavirus pandemic: just how widely among the population has SARS-CoV-2 — the virus which causes COVID-19 — spread among the general population. A team at the University of Bonn has tested a randomized sample of 1,000 residents of the town of Gangelt in the north-west of the country, one of the epicenters of the outbreak in Germany. The study found that two percent of the population currently had the virus and that 14 percent were carrying antibodies suggesting that they had already been infected — whether or not they experienced any symptoms. Eliminating an overlap between the two groups, the team concluded that 15 percent of the town have been infected with the virus.

This number matters hugely because it tells us what we need to know in order to judge how deadly the virus is and also how easily it spreads. It tells us, ultimately, how useful the methods are that we are employing in order to combat the virus. As explained here before, the question of how many people already have the infection is at the heart of a debate between epidemiologists at the Imperial College and Oxford university.

Two weeks ago, the latter published modeling claiming that up to half the UK population might already have been infected with the virus — a level of infection which would mean that lockdown may be the wrong approach, as we would already have achieved a state of herd immunity, preventing the further spread of the disease.

The Gangelt study does not provide support for the idea that half of the population of Britain, or any other country, has been infected with the virus. But for a town to have an infection rate of 15 percent suggests that the virus had spread a lot further than many believed. Neil Ferguson, who leads the Imperial team, told the FT this week that he believes between three and five percent of the UK population has already been infected.
...
Data from coronavirus deaths in Gangelt suggests an infection mortality rate of 0.37 percent, significantly below the 0.9 percent which Imperial College has estimated, or the 0.66 percent found in a revised study last week.
...

[KhunDon]

10 hours ago, Krapow said:

I'm that bored I'm going through 3 books a day. 

But did you do your usual trick and eat the leftover crayons. 🤣

[KhunDon]

6 hours ago, thegrogmonster said:

That it is.

It is 2pm on a Saturday, I am at home and walking around the house in my underpants.

I’ll alert the media, you’re sure to get your 15 minutes of fame and a nice little earner out of the picture rights. 🤣