fygjam

Well I'm glad this didn't appear in the New York Times or posting it would result in another bout of anti-NYT bashing. In a joint statement released on Monday, Germany drug company BioNTech and its American partner Pfizer said there was "no data" to demonstrate that the protection offered by the first dose would be sustained after three weeks. "The safety and efficacy of the vaccine has not been evaluated on different dosing schedules as the majority of trial participants received the second dose within the window specified in the study design," the companies said in a joint statement. With Reuters https://www.watoday.com.au/world/europe/pfizer-biontech-warn-uk-against-plans-to-delay-second-vaccine-jab-20210105-p56rqj.html This is in response to "the other shoe dropping". The first shoe was the updating in December of the UK guidelines for administering the Covid-19 vaccines. The update permitting the first and second doses to be vaccines of different manufacture. The second shoe was the decision to increase the interval for receiving the second dose of vaccine from 3 weeks, as determined by the manufacturer based on clinical trial data, to 12 weeks based on someone's "expert opinion". In my opinion, the update to the vaccination guidelines was necessary because, in another fluster cluck, those administering the vaccination program have absolutely no idea of which vaccines will be available in 12 weeks time. Does this really matter. The UK JCVI prioritizes recipients of the vaccines as residents in a care home for older adults and their carers all those 80 years of age and over and frontline health and social care workers all those 75 years of age and over all those 70 years of age and over and clinically extremely vulnerable individuals all those 65 years of age and over all individuals aged 16 years to 64 years with underlying health conditions which put them at higher risk of serious disease and mortality all those 60 years of age and over all those 55 years of age and over all those 50 years of age and over https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/priority-groups-for-coronavirus-covid-19-vaccination-advice-from-the-jcvi-30-december-2020/joint-committee-on-vaccination-and-immunisation-advice-on-priority-groups-for-covid-19-vaccination-30-december-2020 It is scientifically proven, as opposed to "expert opinion", that a person's immune response wanes with age. That's why, in Australia, the old fart's flu vaccine (65's and older) is "supercharged" compared to the vaccine available to the general public. So who are likely to have a reduced immune response to vaccination? all those 80 years of age all those 75 years of age and over all those 70 years of age all those 65 years of age and over Who are most likely to be on this 12 week mix 'n match schedule? residents in a care home for older adults all those 80 years of age all those 75 years of age and over all those 70 years of age all those 65 years of age and over Would anyone really fly with an airline that arbitrarily quadrupled the mandatory service life of components so they could offer more flights?

As William "the refrigerator" Perry would say "I eat hamburgers bigger than you"

Don't forget to mix in some Tom Waits.

December 18, 2020 06:02 AM KUALA LUMPUR, MALAYSIA - Thailand says a local laboratory's pact with Britain's AstraZeneca will make the Southeast Asian country the regional hub for supplies of what's likely to be one of the leading vaccines against COVID-19 as governments scramble to lock in supplies. Bangkok-based Siam Bioscience signed a letter of intent with AstraZeneca late last month to make 200 million doses of the British pharmaceutical firm's COVID-19 vaccine, AZD1222, said Nakorn Premsri, director of Thailand's National Vaccine Institute. Thailand's Public Health Ministry and the local conglomerate SCG, with its packaging and chemicals divisions, also joined the deal. Nakorn said most of the doses would head abroad. "Thailand will secure only 26 million doses. We may ask for more, but it will not be a big part, so maybe more than half of that [200 million] can be exported," he told VOA. "It's in the letter of intent that we made together with Siam Bioscience, AstraZeneca, SCG and Ministry of Public Health that it will be distributed within the ASEAN region," he added, referring to the 10-member Association of Southeast Asian Nations. Nakorn said AstraZeneca has already started sharing the technology Siam Bioscience will need to make its vaccine and that production could begin in the second quarter of next year. If all goes well, he said, inoculations could start by the middle of the year. Because those taking AstraZeneca's vaccine will need two doses each, the 26 million jabs Thailand has reserved will be enough for 13 million people, about a fifth of the country's population. How the rest of the doses are rolled out across Southeast Asia, a region of over 650 million people, will be up to the British firm, said Nakorn. https://www.voanews.com/covid-19-pandemic/thai-firm-joins-astrazeneca-make-covid-19-vaccine-southeast-asia

I think he is also forgetting that the UK is importing both the Pfizer and Oxford vaccines presumably because the UK doesn't have the manufacturing capability to meet demand. And of course, Thailand has a manufacturing agreement with AstraZeneca.

What is there not to believe. The story said that British guidelines permitted the use of vaccines from different manufacturers. That is true. The story also said that the US CDC guidelines did not permit the use of vaccines from different manufacturers. That is also true. The efficacy of each vaccine was based on recipients receiving a prime and boost dose of the same vaccine not some mix and match cocktail. Where is the clinical trial data for mix and match? Evidence based medicine requires you run the trial, analyse the data and make conclusions. Not some WAG that it will work. I'm pretty sure nobody will drop dead if they receive the cocktail, on the other hand I'd be dubious about the level of immunity provided until shown by a clinical trial. From what I understand, the Pfizer and Oxford vaccines may target different parts of the spike protein. Oh, the journalist is also a doctor, a real one. She holds a Ph.D. in microbiology and immunobiology so I think she's qualified. PS. WAG - wild arse guess.

Except the government's (Public Health England) own guidelines imply that it is ok to mix and match in certain circumstances. From https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/948757/Greenbook_chapter_14a_v4.pdf If an interval longer than the recommended interval is left between doses, the second dose should still be given (preferably using the same vaccine as was given for the first dose if possible). The course does not need to be restarted. To me, preferably means desirable but NOT mandatory. and Previous incomplete vaccination If the course is interrupted or delayed, it should be resumed using the same vaccine but the first dose should not be repeated. There is no evidence on the interchangeability of the COVID-19 vaccines although studies are underway. Therefore, every effort should be made to determine which vaccine the individual received and to complete with the same vaccine. For individuals who started the schedule and who attend for vaccination at a site where the same vaccine is not available, or if the first product received is unknown, it is reasonable to offer one dose of the locally available product to complete the schedule. This option is preferred if the individual is likely to be at immediate high risk or is considered unlikely to attend again. In these circumstances, as both the vaccines are based on the spike protein, it is likely the second dose will help to boost the response to the first dose. For this reason, until additional information becomes available, further doses would not then be required. Again implies that while using the same vaccine for the second dose is desirable it's not mandatory. While the NYT article is a bit of a beat up, it's not factually incorrect.

Nothing new. March 2016 The emergence of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus (SARS-CoV) and Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS)-CoV highlights the continued risk of cross-species transmission leading to epidemic disease. This manuscript describes efforts to extend surveillance beyond sequence analysis, constructing chimeric and full-length zoonotic coronaviruses to evaluate emergence potential. Focusing on SARS-like virus sequences isolated from Chinese horseshoe bats, the results indicate a significant threat posed by WIV1-CoV. Both full-length and chimeric WIV1-CoV readily replicated efficiently in human airway cultures and in vivo, suggesting capability of direct transmission to humans. In addition, while monoclonal antibody treatments prove effective, the SARS-based vaccine approach failed to confer protection. Together, the study indicates an ongoing threat posed by WIV1-related viruses and the need for continued study and surveillance. https://www.pnas.org/content/113/11/3048 But then science meets politics. The Global Health Security and Biodefense unit — responsible for pandemic preparedness — was established in 2015 by Barack Obama’s National Security Advisor, Susan Rice. In May 2018, the team was disbanded and its head Timothy Ziemer, top White House official in the NSC for leading U.S. response against a pandemic, left the Trump administration.

There's no monopoly on stupidity.

Come down under and try it, we need the money... A tourist from Adelaide has been fined $13,000 after he escaped hotel quarantine just hours after landing in Perth to go clubbing with a friend in the city. The 25-year-old fronted Perth Magistrates Court on Tuesday where he pleaded guilty to five counts of failing to comply with a direction under the Emergency Management Act. $AU13,000 is about GBP7,300.

The Slough cough? I'm going with Pomona pneumonia for the variant a US flight crew deposited in Sydney and now it's spreading everywhere. (Pomona being a place in both California and Queensland, all bases covered.)

It's the old "it's not the fall that kills you, it's the stop at the end" logic. An effect of Covid-19 is hypercoagulability. As I posted back in March, a comment from a New York doctor "we're finding blood clots the size of hot dogs in Covid patients". I'd take a guess that the procedure was to remove a "hot dog" and it broke up and caused a heart attack. Edit. It wasn't March it was April 13 when I posted about "hot dogs".

See if you can work it out.

Personal opinion expressed already!

Answered already. Apparently you had trouble understanding the answer. Keep it up, you may end up on the bench which will have the same effect.

You really are getting desperate! Last point first. The comment in The Lancet was just that. Comment commissioned by the editor, it was NOT a study although the unsophisticated may not be able to tell the difference. A study involves actually studying something and collecting data, analysis and conclusions. Please show the data from The Lancet comment. Next, show us where the big pharma boys have guaranteed the duration of the vaccines. Come on, put up or STFU. However anyone who knows even a little bit about immunology knows that long lasting immunity requires a good T cell response. Memory T cells are antigen-specific T cells that remain long-term after an infection has been eliminated. The memory T cells are quickly converted into large numbers of effector T cells upon re-exposure to the specific invading antigen, thus providing a rapid response to past infection. The function of a vaccine is to simulate a past infection. The manufactures of the 3 vaccines which have an emergency use approval are claiming good T cell response although I don't think they have provided any data. After all the aim of the Phase III vaccine trials was to prove efficacy against disease (which they did). And T cell response is harder to measure compared to B cell response. The Phase IV trial (mass vaccination of the general population) is when the durability of immunity will be measured. I know you think that lack of durability data fits in with your "nothing does anything so there is no point in doing anything" approach. It doesn't. Put on your big boy pants and suck it up. As for me, if it lasts a year then it's the same as the flu vaccination. Anything else is a bonus.

Some people think they're as good as Aaron Rogers, Patrick Mahomes or Jim Plunkett.

Who's the one keeps crying "address the post not the poster". But yes, I skimmed it. It's only comment. Most Comments are commissioned by journal editors Is it reviewed? Probably only by the editor who commissioned the piece and only to check for spelling and grammar. Certainly not peer reviewed. Is it based on scientific method and the analysis of data? No! Still it helps those who want to push the line "nothing does anything so there is no point in doing anything". Some people are just attracted by shiny baubles this time of year. On the other hand, if you had understood my post, probably too sophisticated for some, you would have realized that I agreed with the comment. Given the possible vaccine uptake in some areas it is unlikely that herd immunity will be achieved. So business opportunity, invest in funeral homes and coffin makers. PS. Roy M Anderson, lead author of the comment and Non-Executive Director of GlaxoSmithKline for 10 years up to June, 2018. Nothing to do with the Glaxo/Sanofi vaccine effort bombing.

It never ceases to fascinate me how some people are so scared of Covid that they spend their time searching for material that supports their view "nothing does anything so there is no point in doing anything". When my number for vaccination comes up I'll be there because (based on current data) It will protect me against disease 95%. It will protect me against severe disease 100%. Thus I'll also be protected against the selfish who's only concern is their share portfolio and the foolish who see the rules of lockdown as more like suggestions. Whether it contributes herd immunity (or herd mentality) I really couldn't give a fuk. Published data already says that recipients of the Oxford and Moderna vaccines have shown positive swabs for viral RNA post vaccination so vaccination probably doesn't protect against infection. Whether this means that the vaccinated can still be infectious remains to be determined although I'd say it's better than 50-50 that they are. If that's the case then 100% vaccinated will be required to achieve herd immunity or there will be a Darwinian cull of certain segments of the population. Roll on March (current timetable for mass vaccinations to commence in Oz).

Some people get it, there's hope yet.

No! Just a few problems. Asymptomatic infections do NOT generate a very strong or long lasting immune response. You can get re-infected. There is some evidence that there might be a dengue like effect and a second infection can be more serious than the first. Even among those in their 30s and 40s. First infection, headache and sore throat, second infection, brown bread. With every person infected, even asymptomatic infections, the virus replicates. With each replication the virus mutates. The more mutations, the better the chance of hitting the jackpot. i.e. increasing the mortality to SARS 1 (10%) or MERS (30%) levels. Even if that doesn't happen there's the chance of a mutation which can infect the vaccinated.

That didn't take long... UK could be thrown into ‘Tier 5’ national lockdown harsher than November COVID-19 circuit-breaker The UK could be thrown into an unprecedented “Tier 5” lockdown with the harshest restrictions they’ve faced this year. https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/global/uk-could-be-thrown-into-tier-5-national-lockdown-harsher-than-november-covid19-circuitbreaker/news-story/d040adec3e2bcf03477834759ca3e6ca https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/13587644/britain-tier-5-national-lockdown/

And yet they (lockdowns) do work. That's why the last locally acquired case where I am was April 11th.