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Just spitting in the wind


code_slayer_bkk
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I watched this program tonight .. what bullshit ...

With all of the " hopes and dreams " when you are a junkie ,, your life is f***d

Free methadone ... ? ... WTF ?

I grew up around a shit load of junkies and regardless how hard they tried ( which in reality - very little effort ) they always had an excuse for getting high again ..... always

You should just throw these fucks into a boot camp .. no mercy .. get straight or die ...  you return to the life .. you die

I have no pity for these fucks ... there are more efforts that are more important ... a fucking junkie ... give me a break ...

 

 

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I know plenty of drug addicts and alcoholics (which totally destroys families and lives every bit as much as heroin or whatever) who have turned their life around, everything from IV heroin, mainlining crack and heroin, smoking crack, benzos, whatever. Everybody is an individual and different, some cannot or will not ever stop using drugs, some will. Your life doesn't have to be f***d. 

Didn't watch the video, but the reason they give out 'free methadone' as you call it, is that it's pretty hard to sort your life and various issues out, when you've a raging habit that is all consuming from as soon as you waken up, so you have to go sell, steal, sell your ass, do whatever to feed it. On a methadone script, once titrated, you're stable, not 'sick', so then can try to sort your life out, if you want.  It makes sense in all sorts of ways, it's cheap as chips, stops crime, the jails are full. It's cost effective if nothing else. 

You have to be pragmatic about a very complex situation, you can't shoot all junkies as you call them, well, unless you're in the Philippines or under Khun T a few years ago, you can't lock them all up forever, considering how much it costs to keep someone in jail, nevermind them being full to the brim, at least in the UK. So what do you do! You have to give people a chance and the support to try to turn their life around at least!  Sure many will just keep using, the whole lifestyle, do some real shitty stuff, and deserve everything that's coming to them, causing all sort of crime and misery to their families and society in general. But one size does not fit al, if it was that easy, the problem would have sorted years ago.

Seen a news report the other day, Thailand worst country in the world currently for meth use. Addiction can hit anyone, anyone!

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4 hours ago, Krapow said:

you can't shoot all junkies as you call them, well, unless you're in the Philippines or under Khun T a few years ago

I would've thought shooting the importers, suppliers and dealers would be a more productive use of bullets.

 

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5 hours ago, Krapow said:

I know plenty of drug addicts and alcoholics (which totally destroys families and lives every bit as much as heroin or whatever) who have turned their life around, everything from IV heroin, mainlining crack and heroin, smoking crack, benzos, whatever. Everybody is an individual and different, some cannot or will not ever stop using drugs, some will. Your life doesn't have to be f***d. 

Didn't watch the video, but the reason they give out 'free methadone' as you call it, is that it's pretty hard to sort your life and various issues out, when you've a raging habit that is all consuming from as soon as you waken up, so you have to go sell, steal, sell your ass, do whatever to feed it. On a methadone script, once titrated, you're stable, not 'sick', so then can try to sort your life out, if you want.  It makes sense in all sorts of ways, it's cheap as chips, stops crime, the jails are full. It's cost effective if nothing else. 

You have to be pragmatic about a very complex situation, you can't shoot all junkies as you call them, well, unless you're in the Philippines or under Khun T a few years ago, you can't lock them all up forever, considering how much it costs to keep someone in jail, nevermind them being full to the brim, at least in the UK. So what do you do! You have to give people a chance and the support to try to turn their life around at least!  Sure many will just keep using, the whole lifestyle, do some real shitty stuff, and deserve everything that's coming to them, causing all sort of crime and misery to their families and society in general. But one size does not fit al, if it was that easy, the problem would have sorted years ago.

Seen a news report the other day, Thailand worst country in the world currently for meth use. Addiction can hit anyone, anyone!

Bro .. maybe I didn't say what I meant

I just think you give a person 1 chance to get straight ,, I am all for it ... sometimes people fall into shit ... they need help .. I agree

but, when they fall off the wagon .. then forget ... how many times are you supposed to help them ?  Are you supposed to give them free shit the remainder of their lives ?  People are gonna have to take responsibility for their own lives sooner versus later and later and later

I grew up during NY's heroin epidemic ... I witnessed the ravage it caused .. the despair, the wrecked lives ... who knows, maybe there is still an epidemic there ...

Meth has been a serious problem here for many years ... I watched something the other day .. and I didn't realize that Thailand also has the highest number of suicides in Asia as well .. people overwhelming the help lines here and no one answers the fucking hot line phones ... sad

 

 

Edited by code_slayer_bkk
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You cannot just keep on giving, giving and giving without any type of retribution, or a cost ...

Even in love .. you cannot ever take any shit ....

Seems to me these junkies get away with all kinds of shit and never suffer any penalties ... or costs

Yea, I may sound like a hard ass but you have to pay the price with the decisions you make in life ... simple .. addiction isn't an excuse .. it was a choice you made ... cowboy the f**k up ...

Believe me ,, I have smoked a shit load of ganja , done a shit load of acid and speed .. never any coke, meth or heroin .. true ..

It was and is my choice .. did I turn into a junkie .. f**k no ... I could have taken that "out" "in life ... never

So, I only have empathy to a certain point ...

"Get up - Stand up" .. be counted .. make a contribution to life and your fellow man ~!  Don't keep on sucking the tit

 

Edited by code_slayer_bkk
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7 hours ago, fygjam said:

I would've thought shooting the importers, suppliers and dealers would be a more productive use of bullets.

 

You're entitled to think what you want, but that will never happen in the real world, at least where you and i live.

So you have to have real world solutions to real world problems. 

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6 hours ago, code_slayer_bkk said:

Bro .. maybe I didn't say what I meant

I just think you give a person 1 chance to get straight ,, I am all for it ... sometimes people fall into shit ... they need help .. I agree

but, when they fall off the wagon .. then forget ... how many times are you supposed to help them ?  Are you supposed to give them free shit the remainder of their lives ?  People are gonna have to take responsibility for their own lives sooner versus later and later and later

I grew up during NY's heroin epidemic ... I witnessed the ravage it caused .. the despair, the wrecked lives ... who knows, maybe there is still an epidemic there ...

Meth has been a serious problem here for many years ... I watched something the other day .. and I didn't realize that Thailand also has the highest number of suicides in Asia as well .. people overwhelming the help lines here and no one answers the fucking hot line phones ... sad

 

 

What free shit, methadone?

Methadone costs buttons to produce, and is used as a very, very cost effective harm reduction tool. Harm reduction to society in general. It's not about giving 'free shit' it's used as it has loads of benefits to society. 

You have to be pragmatic, people always have and always will use drugs, for all sorts of reasons. Methadone programmes save untold amounts of money, cuts way down on the associated drug related crime, free up Police resources, Court time, cost of prison, and health related stuff, and also saves lives. Nevermind stabilising people so they can try to get their shit together, instead of having a raging habit they need to feed that consumes their every waking minute, so they can't try t get their shit together without detox etc.

You have to live in the real world, you can't shoot drug addicts, at least in most places, you can't lock them up and throw away the key due to costs if nothing else. So when you say if they fall off the wagon once then forget them, what exactly do you mean?  I fell off the wagon after getting clean and sober, so what should have happened to me then?

Sure people have take responsibility for their actions, i fully agree, and people are made to as well. But offering a methadone programme is a very cost effective tool in dealing with a very complex issue.

If it was that easy, it would have been done years ago.

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31 minutes ago, Krapow said:

You're entitled to think what you want, but that will never happen in the real world, at least where you and i live.

So you have to have real world solutions to real world problems. 

But, it happens still in places .. Asia and the middle East .. including Russia ... people getting blown away ... is that the ultimate solution ... not sure ... I think a lot of the junkies are just cockroaches ... and yes, I totally understand their dilemma

Excuses, excuses and even more excuses ... just because they can't handle themselves .. and the majority cannot even get a grip ..... enough ~!

I don't even live in the USA .. but, every year I have to pay a shit load .. I mean a shit load of taxes to the US government .. what the f**k for ... for methadone clinics .. f**k me

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7 minutes ago, Krapow said:

What free shit, methadone?

Methadone costs buttons to produce, and is used as a very, very cost effective harm reduction tool. Harm reduction to society in general. It's not about giving 'free shit' it's used as it has loads of benefits to society. 

You have to be pragmatic, people always have and always will use drugs, for all sorts of reasons. Methadone programmes save untold amounts of money, cuts way down on the associated drug related crime, free up Police resources, Court time, cost of prison, and health related stuff, and also saves lives. Nevermind stabilising people so they can try to get their shit together, instead of having a raging habit they need to feed that consumes their every waking minute, so they can't try t get their shit together without detox etc.

You have to live in the real world, you can't shoot drug addicts, at least in most places, you can't lock them up and throw away the key due to costs if nothing else. So when you say if they fall off the wagon once then forget them, what exactly do you mean?  I fell off the wagon after getting clean and sober, so what should have happened to me then?

Sure people have take responsibility for their actions, i fully agree, and people are made to as well. But offering a methadone programme is a very cost effective tool in dealing with a very complex issue.

If it was that easy, it would have been done years ago.

Ok .. you make a compelling argument .. lets get the statistics ... a totally different picture than what you are painting ...

It is not complex .. simple in mind .. you f***d up .. is society required to " pay for your f**k up "  the remainder of your time on earth .... I think not

 

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2 hours ago, code_slayer_bkk said:

You cannot just keep on giving, giving and giving without any type of retribution, or a cost ...

Even in love .. you cannot ever take any shit ....

Seems to me these junkies get away with all kinds of shit and never suffer any penalties ... or costs

Yea, I may sound like a hard ass but you have to pay the price with the decisions you make in life ... simple .. addiction isn't an excuse .. it was a choice you made ... cowboy the f**k up ...

Believe me ,, I have smoked a shit load of ganja , done a shit load of acid and speed .. never any coke, meth or heroin .. true ..

It was and is my choice .. did I turn into a junkie .. f**k no ... I could have taken that "out" "in life ... never

So, I only have empathy to a certain point ...

"Get up - Stand up" .. be counted .. make a contribution to life and your fellow man ~!  Don't keep on sucking the tit

 

Giving, giving, giving what exactly?

I don't know anywhere where it's all giving, giving giving! 

Drug addicts never suffer any retribution, penalties or costs :default_blink:  What kinda shit is that, prisons are full of drug addicts ffs!  

It's not about being a hardass or a dogooder, liberal or whatever.  It's about trying to live in the real world, having real world solutions to real world problems. 

So just because you took some drugs and didn't turn into a drug addict, you think everyone should be the same?  That's pretty simplistic!

Okay, i'll bet where you grew up plenty didn't get involved in crime, didn't start moving drugs so contributing to causing more drug addicts, costing society loads in Police, Court and Prison costs.  So why didn't you cowboy the f**k up and be like them instead of taking that route? See how simplistic that is?

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12 minutes ago, code_slayer_bkk said:

But, it happens still in places .. Asia and the middle East .. including Russia ... people getting blown away ... is that the ultimate solution ... not sure ... I think a lot of the junkies are just cockroaches ... and yes, I totally understand their dilemma

Excuses, excuses and even more excuses ... just because they can't handle themselves .. and the majority cannot even get a grip ..... enough ~!

I don't even live in the USA .. but, every year I have to pay a shit load .. I mean a shit load of taxes to the US government .. what the f**k for ... for methadone clinics .. f**k me

Russia has a massive drug problem, so not sure i'd want to be quoting them as a model on how to do things.

Again, Methadone clinics save money!  Fucking hell, on one hand you're complaining about the money, but won't accept that methadone programmes save untold money.

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9 minutes ago, code_slayer_bkk said:

Ok .. you make a compelling argument .. lets get the statistics ... a totally different picture than what you are painting ...

It is not complex .. simple in mind .. you f***d up .. is society required to " pay for your f**k up "  the remainder of your time on earth .... I think not

 

https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/principles-drug-addiction-treatment-research-based-guide-third-edition/frequently-asked-questions/drug-addiction-treatment-worth-its-cost

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Basically in most places you cannot shoot drug addicts, tow them and dump them on a deserted island, lock them up and throw away the key, as much as many would like that to happen!

So you have to find real life solutions. 

If it was as easy as just lock them up, then that's what would happen, but it's not financially feasible, at least in the UK, and the jails are full anyway. 

I get the misery addicts cause, i get the hatred, i get the resentment. But people always have and always will take drugs. The so called war of drugs has been a farce. So what do you do? If you lock them all up, then society is paying for them for the rest of their lives, literally! 

Anyways, I can't be bothered going round and round again. Everyone can have their own opinion. I just have personal and professional experience of this issue.

I prefer to live in the real world, real world problems that need real world solutions, not what people think should happen, but reality of what can happen.  

 

Edited by Krapow
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Well, your real world is a lot different than my real world ... I get just sick and tired of a f**k using an excuse of drug addiction .. what is next ?

Talking about personal experience .. . tell me .. lol .. you are alive and not addicted ?

Velvet Underground ... I met Lou Reed on couple occasions .... he is a NY boy ... we were both young .. he seemed like a pretty good guy .. I always liked his music ....

A really good tune ..

 

Edited by code_slayer_bkk
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3 hours ago, code_slayer_bkk said:

[...]

I don't even live in the USA .. but, every year I have to pay a shit load .. I mean a shit load of taxes to the US government .. what the f**k for ... for methadone clinics .. f**k me

The solution is very simple, just renounce your America citizenship. And if Ziggi also has American citizenship, she is cursed with the same problem, at least until her 18th birthday when she can renounce it (if she so wishes).

As for the cost of methadone, it is a lot cheaper than just about any other solution and users don't have to be locked up in clinics, they will voluntarily come to any distribution point they can reach, so unless you are prepared to fund more costly solutions or can come up with a realistic and cheaper solution, I suggest you quit whining.

As for addictions, just look in the mirror, we all know you are addicted to easy women.

EDIT: Not judging on that last point, just stating the obvious.

Edited by Freee!!
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Oh yeah...blame it on the "junkie"...

Drug addiction is a side effect of capitalism. The "medical industrial complex" (MIC) and "big pharma" profit from every pill and shot (mostly legal, sure). Many drug "addicts" in the US started with prescriptions eagerly written by doctors "on the take." From there it's a slippery slope.

"Big Tabacco" is also a player in this. Plus, don't forget alcohol. Tabacco use cause many cancers (MIC makes a whopping amount of $$$ treating cancer), and alcohol destroys many families (enormous societal costs). 

All come from the same root. Profit from people's propensity to seek solutions for their pain (or boredom) and the need for pleasure -- being it real or imagined.

Then there's organized crime, aka the "mafia" and drug "cartels."  They're all over it.

Which brings us back to the poor guy who can't control his habit, just wants to get high, and who's life has fallen apart because of it all.

Maybe a little mercy, compassion and reflection could help them? 

But where's the profit in that.

. . .

Global pharmaceutical industry - statistics & facts
https://www.statista.com/topics/1764/global-pharmaceutical-industry/

Illegal Drug Trade
https://www.rand.org/topics/illegal-drug-trade.html

Inside the economics of illegal drugs, from cryptocurrencies to Major League Baseball
https://journalistsresource.org/economics/economics-illegal-drugs/

"...Online, however, the freebie is much more common than in conventional drug markets, Ladegaard finds. He collected data from an online illegal drug marketplace over 305 days in 2014 and 2015 and analyzed 2,218 posts about free samples in the market’s forum to explore the modern approach to this old story.

Sellers in the marketplace offered hundreds of almost-free samples or promos of nearly all major drugs — cannabis, stimulants, prescription drugs, ecstasy and psychedelics. These samples weren’t entirely free because customers were often asked to pay nominal fees, such as for shipping. Ladegaard also identified 89 almost-free samples of opioids. Thousands more samples were available across drug categories at low-but-not-free prices. Ladegaard capped low-cost samples at about $50.

Many drug sellers, in fact, do not provide samples in order to get users hooked and do not want to provide samples to people already addicted, Ladegaard finds. Sellers largely want reputable reviewers to try their product and leave feedback..."

UNODC World Drug Report 2020: Global drug use rising; while COVID-19 has far reaching impact on global drug markets
https://www.unodc.org/unodc/press/releases/2020/June/media-advisory---global-launch-of-the-2020-world-drug-report.html

 

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