COVID 19 GLOBAL

[roobob]

24 minutes ago, lazarus said:

Just for fun.

Let's keep the medical education deniers out there happy.

Here's part of Dr. Robert Wachter's bio:

https://profiles.ucsf.edu/robert.wachter

So???

Do you deny he said the following...... 

About 1 in 30 San Franciscans may have COVID-19 without knowing it, he said.

 “If you’ve decided you’re OK getting COVID ... then fine to keep mask off in crowded indoor spaces,” he tweeted.

People should keep their “eyes open” because “there’s a lot of COVID out there,” he warned.

For how you are trying to portray the fellow as a so called "expert"...... he still comes across as a quack by the ridiculous and false statements he has made which you posted.

cheers 

 

 

[lazarus]

^ ^

sorry....

Not going to feed the troll this time. 

. . .

When in doubt, wear a mask...otherwise...breathe deep and breathe easy. 😁

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by lazarus
lol - don't feed the tinker trolls...

[fygjam]

52 minutes ago, lazarus said:

^ ^

sorry....

Not going to feed the troll this time. 

. . .

When in doubt, wear a mask...otherwise...breathe deep and breathe easy. 😁

Yeth, big breaths are the tholution.

Thorry about the lithp.

 

[Nightcrawler]

3 hours ago, roobob said:

So???

Do you deny he said the following...... 

About 1 in 30 San Franciscans may have COVID-19 without knowing it, he said.

 “If you’ve decided you’re OK getting COVID ... then fine to keep mask off in crowded indoor spaces,” he tweeted.

People should keep their “eyes open” because “there’s a lot of COVID out there,” he warned.

For how you are trying to portray the fellow as a so called "expert"...... he still comes across as a quack by the ridiculous and false statements he has made which you posted.

cheers 

 

 

Maybe you are missing a point here. Being asymptomatic does not mean that you cannot spread the virus to others who may develop symptoms. That's how it is often spread by people who only think about themselves and f*ck anyone else. I am not an expert either, but common sense tells me that the expert is right and knows far more than I about Covid, and with exception of yourself and perhaps one or two others, knows more about Covid than any of us. 

If I were feeling il, I would prefer to see a doctor rather than self diagnose on some Social Media web site. If my car breaks down, I would feel happier to place it in the hands of a skilled mechanic than some Joe I just met in the street who claims he can fix cars. 

Wearing a mask is largely now a question of choice in many countries, but don't forget thar wearing a mask should be to protect other and not just yourself 

 

[roobob]

23 minutes ago, Nightcrawler said:

Maybe you are missing a point here. Being asymptomatic does not mean that you cannot spread the virus to others who may develop symptoms. That's how it is often spread by people who only think about themselves and f*ck anyone else. I am not an expert either, but common sense tells me that the expert is right and knows far more than I about Covid, and with exception of yourself and perhaps one or two others, knows more about Covid than any of us. 

If I were feeling il, I would prefer to see a doctor rather than self diagnose on some Social Media web site. If my car breaks down, I would feel happier to place it in the hands of a skilled mechanic than some Joe I just met in the street who claims he can fix cars. 

Wearing a mask is largely now a question of choice in many countries, but don't forget thar wearing a mask should be to protect other and not just yourself 

 

Not missing the point at all. This fellow made statements and as I posted above he was off the mark.

I see world wide now that indoor sporting events that no one wears masks...concerts are starting up.... all this came about by Medical advice the different sporting bodies and venues asked for and approved ....other countries are lifting the mask ban.So all of a sudden those medical people are wrong and this fellow is correct.

Yes it is up to the individual if they want to wear a mask or not...but the statements  made by Wachter are nothing but scaremongering and it is sad to see that some actually agree with what came out of his mouth. Here is what this "expert" said again.......

About 1 in 30 San Franciscans may have COVID-19 without knowing it, he said.

 “If you’ve decided you’re OK getting COVID ... then fine to keep mask off in crowded indoor spaces,” he tweeted.

People should keep their “eyes open” because “there’s a lot of COVID out there,” he warned.

The UCSF should really call this bloke in and ask him to justify his outlandish public comments as all he is doing is making disparaging comments from his position which reflects badly upon the UCSF.

cheers 

 

[fforest]

3 hours ago, roobob said:

Not missing the point at all. This fellow made statements and as I posted above he was off the mark.

I see world wide now that indoor sporting events that no one wears masks...concerts are starting up.... all this came about by Medical advice the different sporting bodies and venues asked for and approved ....other countries are lifting the mask ban.So all of a sudden those medical people are wrong and this fellow is correct.

Yes it is up to the individual if they want to wear a mask or not...but the statements  made by Wachter are nothing but scaremongering and it is sad to see that some actually agree with what came out of his mouth. Here is what this "expert" said again.......

About 1 in 30 San Franciscans may have COVID-19 without knowing it, he said.

 “If you’ve decided you’re OK getting COVID ... then fine to keep mask off in crowded indoor spaces,” he tweeted.

People should keep their “eyes open” because “there’s a lot of COVID out there,” he warned.

The UCSF should really call this bloke in and ask him to justify his outlandish public comments as all he is doing is making disparaging comments from his position which reflects badly upon the UCSF.

cheers 

 

And why are San Francisco people not wearing masks very much now?

Well

Because

The 

T.V

said

Its ok to take your masks off...lol

And if the T.V says to wear masks again, they will go right back on...

 

I knew for a very looooooong time now most people are scared to question things... But the big C has shown me it's like 96-97% of people....

Very Sad..... 

Edited May 4, 2022 by fforest

[Nightcrawler]

I was just waiting for you to turn up to the party

[Mr. Smooth]

12 hours ago, lazarus said:

^ I'll take the advice of the head of medicine at one of the country's very best medical universities -- University of California San Francisco -- over a retired postal employee every day. Here in San Francisco we take 'personal responsibility' seriously. Protect our families, protect our neighbors...

I plan to wear a mask again at my local small grocery store. That's about the extent of how this affects my life.

. . .

Hey...who's the forum's drama queen? Why is he ranting?

^ ^ ^

Hey, I'm not the one posting hysterics regarding "spikes" and "OPINION" by a so-called "prominent" voice of Covid who obviously has been oft-quoted by the esteemed SF Chronicle. What I'm doing using plain spoken common sense, is MOCKING the story regarding the numbers and how in placing these cases in CONTEXT....something that always seems to be missing......they do not stand up to simple scrutiny.

A few posts earlier, we had Nightcrawler with the news that there was 15,000 new positive cases PER DAY in the UK, which has a population of roughly 70 million, and that was considered GOOD NEWS, as compared to a few months earlier, with cases dropping. And he described the situation as "improved", which no doubt the medical professionals in the UK would be in agreement.

Now then....contrast that news in the UK with the hysterics and numbers that equate to a statistical zero, for the Bay Area and California.

So one bm, Nightcrawler, posts that 15,000 new cases per day is improved and good news in one place and another bm, Spaz, posts that the new cases which amount to less than one tenth of 1% per 100,000, a microscopic 138 people,  is cause for panic.

For the 2 or 3 usual suspects that this applies to, guys, don't criticize me for bringing this vast disparity of the numbers to light. Just putting things into proper perspective. For those in the UK, I'm happy to hear that. Live your lives as you wish. 

And for any of my fellow Northern California bm's living in San Francisco,  just quit being a Hysterical Harriet and get on with living yours. 

And try not to step in the human feces on the sidewalk when you do.

[lazarus]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Smooth said:

Hey, I'm not the one posting hysterics regarding "spikes" and "OPINION" by a so-called "prominent" voice of Covid who obviously has been oft-quoted by the esteemed SF Chronicle. What I'm doing using plain spoken common sense, is MOCKING the story regarding the numbers and how in placing these cases in CONTEXT....something that always seems to be missing......they do not stand up to simple scrutiny.

A few posts earlier, we had Nightcrawler with the news that there was 15,000 new positive cases PER DAY in the UK, which has a population of roughly 70 million, and that was considered GOOD NEWS, as compared to a few months earlier, with cases dropping. And he described the situation as "improved", which no doubt the medical professionals in the UK would be in agreement.

Now then....contrast that news in the UK with the hysterics and numbers that equate to a statistical zero, for the Bay Area and California.

So one bm, Nightcrawler, posts that 15,000 new cases per day is improved and good news in one place and another bm, Spaz, posts that the new cases which amount to less than one tenth of 1% per 100,000, a microscopic 138 people,  is cause for panic.

For the 2 or 3 usual suspects that this applies to, guys, don't criticize me for bringing this vast disparity of the numbers to light. Just putting things into proper perspective. For those in the UK, I'm happy to hear that. Live your lives as you wish. 

And for any of my fellow Northern California bm's living in San Francisco,  just quit being a Hysterical Harriet and get on with living yours. 

And try not to step in the human feces on the sidewalk when you do.

Bottom line slinky...

You'd have to be a few fries short of a Happy Meal to take issue with one of the most respected physicians in the country regarding advice about avoiding Covid.

That said, I do think it's rather special that you and rooboob are back spamming together again...a match made in heaven!

 

 

[roobob]

It appears that some of Wachter's UCSF  colleagues  do not agree with him and he has his knickers in a knot...lol. The one making no sense is Wachter with his past comments that were posted previously.

cheers

COVID in California: Justice Department appeals order voiding travel mask mandate (msn.com)

Four COVID experts say it’s time to accept reality: Vaccines work, mask mandates don't (sfchronicle.com)

 

Wachter says opinion piece comparing masks against vaccines ‘makes no sense’: Dr. Bob Wachter, UCSF’s Chair of Medicine and a prominent voice on pandemic related issues, is questioning a claim by a group of UCSF doctors who in an opinion piece this week argued, “Vaccines work, masks do not.” Wachter disagrees with the premise of the editorial by his colleagues — Dr. Jeanne Noble, Dr. Norman Hearst and Dr. Monica Gandhi, joined by Daniel Halperin of University of North Carolina — which appeared in The Chronicle. “Framing the choice as vaccines vs. masks sets up a false duality: vaccines are critically important. Adding good-quality masks adds protection in risky setting,” Wachter said in a Twitter post on Wednesday. “Posing this as an ‘or’ vs an ‘and’ makes no more sense than saying you can choose seatbelts or airbags, but not both.” In a conversation on The Chronicle’s Fifth & Mission podcast, Wachter explained why he still supports wearing masks in certain public settings.

[roobob]

Dear oh dear...they should nickname Wachter yo yo...he is up and down on things that he says..... lol.

No wonder his UCSF colleagues and others are in disagreement with him.....and some on here think he is some sort of covid "messiah"........555.

cheers

Should you still wear a mask? We asked UCSF's Dr. Bob Wachter - California News Times

[fygjam]

27 minutes ago, roobob said:

It appears that some of Wachter's UCSF  colleagues  do not agree with him and he has his knickers in a knot...lol. The one making no sense is Wachter with his past comments that were posted previously.

cheers

COVID in California: Justice Department appeals order voiding travel mask mandate (msn.com)

Four COVID experts say it’s time to accept reality: Vaccines work, mask mandates don't (sfchronicle.com)

 

Wachter says opinion piece comparing masks against vaccines ‘makes no sense’: Dr. Bob Wachter, UCSF’s Chair of Medicine and a prominent voice on pandemic related issues, is questioning a claim by a group of UCSF doctors who in an opinion piece this week argued, “Vaccines work, masks do not.” Wachter disagrees with the premise of the editorial by his colleagues — Dr. Jeanne Noble, Dr. Norman Hearst and Dr. Monica Gandhi, joined by Daniel Halperin of University of North Carolina — which appeared in The Chronicle. “Framing the choice as vaccines vs. masks sets up a false duality: vaccines are critically important. Adding good-quality masks adds protection in risky setting,” Wachter said in a Twitter post on Wednesday. “Posing this as an ‘or’ vs an ‘and’ makes no more sense than saying you can choose seatbelts or airbags, but not both.” In a conversation on The Chronicle’s Fifth & Mission podcast, Wachter explained why he still supports wearing masks in certain public settings.

Hey ..roob, what did your experts say?

Four COVID experts say it’s time to accept reality: Vaccines work, mask mandates don't

I suppose you'll be rolling up your sleeve.

The irony, oh the irony...

I wonder what works best for confirmation bias, masks or vaccine.

 

Edited May 5, 2022 by fygjam

[lazarus]

I find it interesting entertaining that an old tinker from backwater Isaan is now an expert on the current San Francisco Covid situation.

What next?

Maybe he'll give Ukraine President Zelensky strategic advice on how to win the war...

. . .

[Mr. Smooth]

2 hours ago, lazarus said:

I find it interesting entertaining that an old tinker from backwater Isaan is now an expert on the current San Francisco Covid situation.

What next?

Maybe he'll give Ukraine President Zelensky strategic advice on how to win the war...

. . .

Nope, roobob just blew a hole in that doctors premise, that it's now sinking quicker than CNN+.  Funny thing Spaz, one of those 4 colleagues of Dr. Wachter, is none other than Dr. Monica Gandhi, a doctor who you yourself has sung the praises of in several of your Covid-related posts in the past! So now, she disagrees with her superior and claims that masks DO NOT WORK! Seems she has some serious reservations about his premise, as did I, as did Roo.

Well now, so what are we to make of this, hmm? Which respected medical expert shall we believe is saying the truth and which one shall we dismiss as nonsense, hmm? Spaz, you gotta fish or cut bait with one of them. They have diametrically opposite opinions, so they obviously can't be both correct.

Since there has been overwhelming evidence that masking just doesn't work, so much so that the CDC even finally admitted it, seems the boss in this case, much like Old Man Fauci himself, has let his ego get the best of him with his "God-complex", and since Dr Gandhi's expert analysis confirms the scrutiny and common sense brought forth by a couple of bm's here, one of whom is a retired postal worker, I'll put my hard earned pension scratch on the chica.

Oh, yeah Spaz, you can serve me fries with that. Make it a large, McDonalds fries are tasty! 😆

 

 

[roobob]

4 hours ago, lazarus said:

I find it interesting entertaining that an old tinker from backwater Isaan is now an expert on the current San Francisco Covid situation.

What next?

Maybe he'll give Ukraine President Zelensky strategic advice on how to win the war...

. . .

What's wrong cobber....caught out again I see.

I have used the references you yourself use to show that Wachter is nothing but a wanna be media/twitter star....nothing more...nothing less.

Also pointed out to you is that one of his detractors is one of your covid heroines.....Dr Monica Gandhi..... so where do you stand on this now cobber...... with your hero or heroine.

I will await your next swerve and meme... ha ha ha .

cheers

[lazarus]

4 minutes ago, roobob said:

What's wrong cobber....caught out again I see.I have used the references you yourself use to show that Wachter is nothing but a wanna be media/twitter star....nothing more...nothing less.Also pointed out to you is that one of his detractors is one of your covid heroines.....Dr Monica Gandhi..... so where do you stand on this now cobber...... with your hero or heroine.I will await your next swerve and meme... ha ha ha . cheers

 

Edited May 5, 2022 by lazarus

[fygjam]

Another wimpy doctor, what would he know?

COVID in WA: AMA WA president Mark Duncan-Smith reveals why he will continue to wear masks

The AMA in this case is the Australian Medical Association.

 

[roobob]

57 minutes ago, fygjam said:

Another wimpy doctor, what would he know?

COVID in WA: AMA WA president Mark Duncan-Smith reveals why he will continue to wear masks

The AMA in this case is the Australian Medical Association.

 

Selective posting again........ it seems you left something out...such as...... WA is removing the mask mandate..... lol

cheers

Western Australia could hit fresh COVID-19 peak as AMA remains nervous over removal of mask mandate (msn.com)

 

[fygjam]

49 minutes ago, roobob said:

Selective posting again........ it seems you left something out...such as...... WA is removing the mask mandate..... lol

cheers

Western Australia could hit fresh COVID-19 peak as AMA remains nervous over removal of mask mandate (msn.com)

 

Your internet search skills are improving, well done.

You are correct

Despite most requirements for mask wearing being removed a doctor, surgeon and WA President of the AMA, has decided to continue wearing a mask.

Seems like Wachter is not the only doctor who thinks mask wearing is a good idea.

The mask mandate was removed a week ago. Today WA recorded the highest number of new cases for the entire pandemic beating yesterday's previous record. Maybe those masks were actually effective in preventing infection and spread!

 

 

[Nightcrawler]

Let's just be honest here, putting personal bias aside for just one moment. I don't read through reams of scientific data, experts and virologists research analyses, not even the MSN to any more than looking at current Government statistics on Covid infections, numbers of deaths, hospitalisation and recovery etc etc etc. 

Let's simply look at where we are today (although "we" will vary from country to country.) 

Most of us are now living with Covid. But what does that actually mean ? 

It means that since the virus has mutated into a less severe and life threatening form of infection, that most restrictions have or are in  the process of being removed depending on which country you look at. 

Whilst the Omicron variant is now the dominant strain and less severe than Delta, it is far more transmittable than the earlier strain, hence the massive rises in cases during the last few months. In some countries or States the numbers are falling where in others they are level or even rising. 

That's what we know

As a result of the symptoms on average being more akin to Flu, less people are concerned about contracting the virus and therefore as a result, it spreads quicker as restrictions are lifted, perhaps, and hopefully until we have achieved herd immunity. But in reality, that has yet to happen and we are in a transitional faze. No magic switch available. 

Regarding the ongoing debates both here and elsewhere,its a circular argument for which there is little common ground, just as there is with politics. I read from Mr Smooth, that there is "overwhelming" evidence that masks were useless again Covid. Now come on, it is not overwhelming at all, but it may seem that way to you because you chose to look for it.  

Now, why is it that if I walk into any NHS or Private hospital, I will find that 99% of people are wearing masks, from patients, doctors, clinicians right down to Porters and ancillary staff. The NHS are not the MSN, they are not a political animal, they have a responsibility to provide Nations health care. Dentists, surgeons and clinicians have worn masks for years and well before covid. They do so to help prevent infection along with sanitisation of hands and equipment. So are they wrong to do so? I think not

No one has ever claimed that masks are 100% effective in stopping spread of infection. They are merely an extra layer of protection. You will often see traffic police in Bangkok and other polluted cities wearing masks which filter out some of the harmful toxins and fumes, whist being directly exposed to them for hours. 

Are vaccines 100% effective against covid? No, but they have never been claimed to be. They are yet another layer of protection in the fight to reduce symptoms and contracting the virus. What we have to realise, is that there is No real data to suggest what WOULD have happened had masks, vaccines and restrictions. We simply cannot know that. 

However the phrase used here in a quote, that "there is a lot of Covid around" is absolutely true, and in most countries. It may be reducing in some countries but it is far from over. 

That doesn't mean it has to be doom and gloom but at the same time have to accept that there are still millions of people contracting the virus on a daily basis, world wide and we should not kid ourselves that it's over yet. 

Now, there are varying degrees of social responsibility, and as in life, there are those who only care directly about themselves and see the world through their own eyes, and there are those who care about the wellbeing of others as well as themselves. 

So it's hardly surprising that all of us are probably wearing masks less than before. 

For me it's simple

Do I want to get Covid and feel like shit for a week or so? 

Not really

So I chose to wear a mask in certain places where I feel that there might be a higher risk of catching Covid 19, such as crowded buses, trains, some stores, doctors waiting room etc. No guarantees of course, but just an extra layer of protection. If I were to be knowingly infected with virus, then  I would isolate, for the benefit of others including friends and family rather than pass it along to others. 

It does seem rather odd to me, that whilst Roobob has said on the past that he thinks that the "experts" are just "glorified teachers" yet when it comes to other experts of his choice, then they are somehow qualified. Give me a break. It's all about finding a narrative, whether on Twitter or elsewhere which supports your own argument, but in reality has no more validity than the research that you criticise. 

For me, much of the Covid arguments have become emotive. We have moved into a new era having suffered in one way or another because of the real enemy, being Covid 19. If you want yo wear a mask, wear one, if you don't and its not mandatory then don't. What's the big fucking deal? Is it worth pages of debate and tit for tat? 😁😁 Well, maybe? 

I reckon we should all be cautiously optimistic. Its not over yet but life has become a damn sight better than it has been for the last couple of years. 

Sorry for such a long post and I don't expect everyone to read it. 

 

[Krapow]

^^^^^

f**k reading all that pish, I'd rather get Covid ffs! 

[Nightcrawler]

44 minutes ago, Krapow said:

^^^^^

f**k reading all that pish, I'd rather get Covid ffs! 

Be careful what you wish for 

[lazarus]

I'll keep my money on Dr. Wachter and the other fine doctors from my region.

Backwater tinkers and 4x4 "ape rapers" should take heed.

. . .

Why getting COVID is still nothing like getting the flu — even if it’s just as ‘normal’

https://www.sfchronicle.com/health/article/Why-getting-COVID-is-still-nothing-like-getting-17148865.php

. . .“Today, for a vaccinated and boosted person, the chances of a severe outcome are comparable to the flu,” said Dr. Bob Wachter, the chair of medicine at UCSF. He noted that Paxlovid, the antiviral pill used to treat COVID-19, even further reduces the chance of death...

... But getting COVID is something different entirely.

“COVID is a very sneaky team. We don’t know that much about it, and they may not play by the rules of the game,” he said.

Experts also noted COVID is far more infectious than the flu, which means that it puts more people at risk of severe disease and death by way of infecting far more people...

“There’s never been a flu season when you would look around and know so many people that had it,” Wachter added.

COVID also brings the potential for long-term effects, including neurological complications, heart disease and diabetes, something that the flu does not have on a large scale, experts said.

“I don’t want to be an alarmist, but there are certain viral diseases that don’t manifest until 10 to 20 years later,” Salinas said. “I am positive that we don’t know yet what the full scale of short, mid- and long-term manifestations are of COVID-19.”...

...But all of this does not mean we have to live in fear of COVID forever, Dr. Jorge Salinas, an assistant professor of infectious disease at Stanford, said. If you get vaccinated and boosted, try to limit time in crowded indoor spaces and wear masks when transmission is high, and try to gather mostly in well-ventilated places or outdoors, you can limit the spread of the disease.

“You can still socialize, you can still do a lot of things, but you can still prevent many COVID infections,” he said. “You’re not going to be able to prevent all of them, but it is possible to continue with your life and at the same time, reduce your risk of getting this infection.”

Edited May 5, 2022 by lazarus
lol

[Nightcrawler]

Meanwhile in UK

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-deaths-involving-coronavirus-rise-for-sixth-successive-week-in-england-and-wales-ons-says-12605253

 

[lazarus]