forcebwithu Posted September 14, 2023 Share Posted September 14, 2023 17 hours ago, lazarus said: Reminded me of the followig from 50 years ago. Soap Box Derby cheating scandal put Boulder boy in spotlight A hometown hero was celebrated, then immediately fell from grace, in the summer of 1973. That August, 14-year-old Jimmy Gronen won the 36th annual All-American Soap Box Derby in Akron, Ohio. His victory came with a sizable trophy and a $7,500 scholarship. Not long after, he also gained notoriety as the first Soap Box Derby champion to be disqualified for cheating. The resulting scandal was the top local story in Boulder in 1973. Race officials noticed Gronen’s molded fiberglass racer had surged forward at the beginning of the race, giving him a significant lead over the other 137 racers. Derby rules stated that cars were to be constructed by the participants and were to run by gravity alone. Upon inspection of the car by the Derby National Control Board, a magnet was discovered in the nose of the fiberglass with a system of wires connecting to a battery pack. A concealed switch behind the headrest activated the electromagnetic system. By leaning back, the driver’s helmet made contact with the switch. ... 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarus Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch Posted September 17, 2023 Author Share Posted September 17, 2023 We do need to remind ourselves that EV technology is in it's infancy (in the mainstream, the very first EV made its appearance in 1835). However, if we remove all the arguments about environmental damage, end of life , build quality , grid support, etc, then it is worth noting that the investment and R&D going into them is massive. As time goes on we'll see 1000 mile ranges off one charge, and possibly a modular system for batteries and longer life of the vehicle itself which reduces environmental impact from cradle to grave of the car. Regarding the charging infrastructure, perhaps wireless charging facilities, ultra fast charging, charge sharing between vehicles and perhaps even roads which offer wireless charging built into the infrastructure. There might be a darker side to the whole transition though. Of course, in a utopian world anyone using a regular diesel or petrol car will eventually be taxed off the road and vilified as a social pariah, the term "polluter" being on par with the term "racist" being used to label anyone remotely not bowing and scraping to the liberal masses. Having a V8 will be like having a burning cross and KKK meeting outside your house every weekend. You'll be a mass murderer, Trump loving relic of the past who refuses to conform while destroying the planet and killing children due to your selfish actions. That may sound a bit extreme, but given that the Mayor of London (Kahn) has labelled anyone disagreeing with his ULEZ expansion as "right wing", then it might not be as extreme as we think. 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarus Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 9 minutes ago, Butch said: You'll be a mass murderer, Trump loving relic of the past who refuses to conform while destroying the planet and killing children due to your selfish actions. Got that right...if the hat fits wear it! . . . 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarus Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 How China sparked chaos in the world of cars Stephen Bartholomeusz The most transformative development in the auto industry’s history since Henry Ford pioneered mass production more than a century ago is threatening both the automotive establishment and its workers and causing angst on both sides of the Atlantic. The European Commission last week announced an investigation into China’s electric vehicle subsidies. The commission’s president Ursula von der Leyen said the global auto industry was being overrun by cheap Chinese vehicles with prices that are being kept “artificially low by huge state subsidies”. In the US the United Auto Workers Union (UAW) launched three strikes on Friday in pursuit of a claim for a 36 per cent increase in wages over the next four years as the union tries to defend the high-paid jobs in the legacy industry from a transition to electric vehicles (EVs) that requires fewer and less well-paid workers because there are fewer moving parts. Most new EV plants in the US are in non-unionised plants in states offering tax incentives, threatening Detroit’s dominance of the industry and the UAW’s members. The Europeans, Americans, Japanese and South Koreans are handicapped in the race to an EV-dominated future because of the dominance of internal combustion-powered vehicles in their markets. They make money from their traditional operations but are losing money in their fledgling EV businesses. Ford, for instance, has said its EV business will lose $US4.5 billion ($7 billion) this year. China, by contrast, is set to dominate the global battery-powered EV industry because more than a decade ago – after realising it had no material competitive advantage in vehicles powered either by internal combustion engines or in the hybrid sector where the Japanese manufacturers led developments – it targeted EVs. It was a centrally-driven strategy, rolled out in 2009, that deployed subsidies for demand, supply and funding of the sector. Beijing provided generous subsidies and tax incentives for purchases of EVs, particularly for taxi fleets, bus fleets and for central and local government agencies but also for consumers in a program that was supposed to be tapered and ultimately phased out by 2021. Local governments and state-owned banks also provided support. For some manufacturers, by the middle of the last decade the subsidies represented more than half their sales revenue, although that proportion has dropped to single-digit percentages as subsidies have tapered and EV sales exploded. The pandemic led to subsidies being extended until the end of this year but the spluttering of China’s economy this year resulted in them being extended again following a mid-year announcement that tax waivers for purchases of EVs and hybrids would remain in place until the end of 2025 and then halved in 2026-27 before the incentives are withdrawn. The decision to pursue EVs was not purely opportunistic. Beijing saw the potential to reduce its carbon emissions through the displacement of the legacy fleet of vehicles and also recognised the potential to leverage its dominance of the supply chain for batteries, which constitute about 40 per cent of an EV’s costs. The strategy, which extended the incentives to foreign manufacturers with plants within China, has been extraordinarily successful. Last year nearly 7 million EVs were sold in China – almost nine times the number sold in the US – in a market where locally-owned auto companies are increasingly displacing and dominating foreign brands. They are also making inroads, with brands like BYD, MG and Polestar, within the international market. While China-manufacturers vehicles account for only about three per cent of the total market, about 15 per cent of sales in the battery-powered EV market in Europe this year have been generated by China-built vehicles, with the SAIC Motor-owned MG brand accounting for about 6 percentage points and EVs from Tesla’s Chinese plants about 4 percentage points. The one big market where Chinese-manufactured EVs haven’t gained a foothold is the US, thanks to the 27.5 per cent tariff that Donald Trump slapped on Chinese auto imports, which more than wiped out the estimated 20 per cent or so cost advantage – mainly from lower labour costs – Chinese manufacturers have over their Western competitors. Europe, with its mandated targets for carbon emissions reductions and a commitment to end sales of gasoline and diesel-powered vehicles by 2035, is by far the most attractive market for the Chinese companies. It also helps at the margin that tariffs are weighted in China’s favour. Cars exported from Europe to China face a 15 per cent tariff rate. Those going in the other direction are levied only 10 per cent. If China is able to dominate global EV production it will transform industrial landscapes across the world, given the significance of auto manufacturing within economies and, because of the advanced engineering capabilities it develops, across industry sectors. The German export powerhouses – Volkswagen, BMW, Mercedes and Audi – have major conventional and EV manufacturing facilities in China but the slowing economic activity amid weak consumer confidence has, despite the extension of the incentives to purchase EVs, created substantial excess capacity and ignited a price war (which Tesla has been aggressively participating in). The European economies are also struggling and, with the cheaper Chinese brands making accelerating inroads, there is real concern about the future of the auto sector in Europe. The idea of a future where Germany imports its Volkswagens or BMWs from China, unsurprisingly, isn’t appealing to German policymakers or auto unions. The German manufacturers, however, have such large investments in China that they are unsettled by the EC’s announcement of the investigating of China’s EV subsidies, fearing China – which labelled the move protectionist – will retaliate. China’s EVs and their batteries are technically sophisticated – they are out-competing most of the major Western brands in electronics and software – while the government-promoted and incentivised take-up of EVs means their EV sector is growing within the Without legacy operations and profits to protect and dominance of the battery supply chain, there is the potential for China to replicate the similar path it took to dominance of the global solar sector, an industry where Europe, as a first-mover in response to climate change, once was an industry leader. It isn’t surprising that references to that experience have cropped up in European discussions. Joe Biden’s Inflation Reduction Act, enacted last year, contains substantial incentives to build and buy EVs (a point of some irritation for Europeans) but the US badly lags China, which claims to be as much as five years ahead of the rest of the world in terms of EV and battery technologies. If China is able to dominate global EV production it will transform industrial landscapes across the world, given the significance of auto manufacturing within economies and, because of the advanced engineering capabilities it develops, across industry sectors. Whether it is another bout of protectionism, or more subsidies of their own, or both, other auto manufacturing centres like the US, Europe, Japan and South Korea and their workforces may need more help from policymakers to survive. https://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/how-china-sparked-chaos-in-the-world-of-cars-20230918-p5e5fn.html 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrmango Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 On 9/18/2023 at 12:40 AM, Zeb said: The decision to pursue EVs was not purely opportunistic. Beijing saw the potential to reduce its carbon emissions through the displacement of the legacy fleet of vehicles and also recognised the potential to leverage its dominance of the supply chain for batteries, which constitute about 40 per cent of an EV’s costs. What a load of krap. Ok they are the leading builders of EV, and coal generators. Does the writer think we don't see that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 Hyundai to invest $12.6 billion in EV manufacturing, battery production in Georgia Hyundai Motor Group 005380, -0.52% on Tuesday said it is investing $12.6 billion in new EV manufacturing and battery production in Georgia that will employ thousands. The investment includes the $7.59 billion Hyundai Motor Group Metaplant America site in Bryan County, Ga., that will create more than 8,500 jobs, and the $5 billion battery manufacturing facility joint venture with SK On Co. in Bartow County, Ga., that will employ about 3,500 people. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/hyundai-to-invest-12-6-billion-in-ev-manufacturing-battery-production-in-georgia-aadaa088?siteid=rss 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarus Posted September 21, 2023 Share Posted September 21, 2023 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 BYD going from strength to strength - 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarus Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch Posted October 6, 2023 Author Share Posted October 6, 2023 Oh Dear... https://metro.co.uk/2023/10/04/man-kidnapped-by-his-own-car-and-had-to-crash-into-a-police-to-stop-19601765/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stillearly Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 Electric cars will cost British motorists an extra £6,000 if Rishi Sunakfails to strike a post-Brexit deal with the EU on tariffs, industry bosses have told The Independent. UK manufacturers warned of a “devastating price war” on consumers – threatening both the electric vehicle (EV) market and the UK’s climate change commitments – if tariffs are enforced in January 2024. In the latest major Brexit row, the Sunak government is pushing the European Commission to agree to delay the costly new rules set to come in at the start of next year as part of Boris Johnson’s Brexit trade deal. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coxyhog Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/net-zero/burning-electric-cars-dunked-baths-water-stop-fires-spread/ Quote: A government spokesman said: “There is no evidence that electric vehicle fires are more likely to occur than petrol or diesel vehicle fires and it remains safe to have them in covered car parks. His lips were moving so he must've been lying. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpuynarak Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 9 hours ago, coxyhog said: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/net-zero/burning-electric-cars-dunked-baths-water-stop-fires-spread/ Quote: A government spokesman said: “There is no evidence that electric vehicle fires are more likely to occur than petrol or diesel vehicle fires and it remains safe to have them in covered car parks. His lips were moving so he must've been lying. and i don't believe that...........lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrmango Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 3 hours ago, Pumpuynarak said: and i don't believe that...........lol I don't either. Lots of vids showing EV cars burning and fire trucks unable to put the fire out. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 VW to stop selling fossil-fueled cars in Norway October 22, 2023 Volkswagen (VW), long one of the major car dealers in Norway, has announced it will stop selling all models fueled by gasoline and diesel after New Year. The German producer and its Norwegian importer point to the massive rise of electric car sales in recent years. “As a final farewell to fossil cars, the last order for a Volkswagen Golf will be taken towards the end of the year,” said Ulf Tore Hekneby, director of Norway’s importer of Volkswagen cars, Møller Bil. He called sales of electric cars in Norway “a formidable success,” while the market for fossil-fueled cars has all but crashed.” Yet only weeks ago VW was saying it had to cut back on EV production lines in Europe because buyers didn’t want them. This of course contradicted the facts surrounding very significant increases in EV sales in most European countries. https://www.newsinenglish.no/2023/10/22/vw-stops-selling-fossil-fueled-cars-in-norway/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Uber is importing 10,000 electric vehicles from China that it intends to issue to drivers under a rent-to-buy scheme as it accelerates its green ride-share plans. The vehicles are being imported under a partnership between Uber and EVDirect, the Australian distributor for Chinese electric carmaker BYD. https://www.smh.com.au/environment/sustainability/uber-s-surge-plan-to-bring-10-000-electric-vehicles-into-australia-20231024-p5eeob.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 A stroll around the Guangzhou Auto Show 2023. It’s astounding what the Chinese auto industry is doing! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stillearly Posted November 11, 2023 Share Posted November 11, 2023 Tesla fire https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-67389134 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forqalso Posted November 11, 2023 Share Posted November 11, 2023 According to one analysis of U.S. government data, EV fires appear to occur less frequently than ICE vehicles, with 25.1 fires for every 100,000 vehicles sold compared to 1,529 fires for ICE vehicles. (Hybrids, interestingly, appear to catch fire most frequently, perhaps a result of the battery pack being adjacent to a combustion engine.) Data from the Swedish government and a major EV vendor appears to support this general assessment. From: https://core.verisk.com/Insights/Emerging-Issues/Articles/2023/August/Week-4/Electric-Vehicle-Fire-Risk# 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeb Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 “We can’t catch up” - How Tesla is changing auto assembly lines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coxyhog Posted November 22, 2023 Share Posted November 22, 2023 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maipenrai Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 Another good analysis of the current EV situation: https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2023/12/08/Electric-Vehicle-Dream-Sputters-True-Climate-Crisis-Survival/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 How the average family punter can afford a new electric car is beyond me. Or new tires every 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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