The Derek Chauvin George Floyd Murder Trial.

[Kathmandu]

7 minutes ago, roobob said:

Ok...lets go with an Appeal... or an appeal trial...you are happy with that???

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

Why not? Never going to happen. As I said, hold the trial in roobullshit Aus and he'll be found guilty again. How long does this charade need to go on before you're satisfied? 

[fygjam]

11 minutes ago, roobob said:

Ok...lets go with an Appeal... or an appeal trial...you are happy with that???

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

 

17 minutes ago, lazarus said:

Don't know much about US law, do ya?

Big difference between the two.

Still doesn't.

An appeal is not a trial or retrial!

An appeal is based on the legal principals relating to the conduct of a trial.

 

[lazarus]

16 minutes ago, roobob said:

Ok...lets go with an Appeal... or an appeal trial...you are happy with that???

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

^ 
Whatever floats your boat, roob.

No way in hell the verdict will be overturned.

21 hours ago, lazarus said:

"A motion for a new trial is a defendant's request to have a new jury hear and redecide the case"

...

"A denial of the motion means that the initial guilty verdict stands. But even after a denial of the motion, a defendant though can still win a second chance if he is successful on appealing his case.

Also note that there are times when a court, even though it does not order another trial, may:

>> modify the defendant’s verdict to a lesser included offense of the convicted charge, or
>> reduce the degree of the charge."

 

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by lazarus

[roobob]

2 hours ago, lazarus said:

^ 
Whatever floats your boat, roob.

No way in hell the verdict will be overturned.

 

Why not just answer the question.....here it is again...

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

[Kathmandu]

49 minutes ago, roobob said:

Why not just answer the question.....here it is again...

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

Probably not, but you can always dream I guess.

[lazarus]

3 hours ago, roobob said:

Why not just answer the question.....here it is again...

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

 

6 hours ago, lazarus said:

No way in hell the verdict will be overturned.

Already answered. R e a d t h e w o r d s.

[roobob]

7 minutes ago, lazarus said:

 

Already answered. R e a d t h e w o r d s.

Ok...so you say no.

cheers

[Painter]

4 hours ago, roobob said:

Why not just answer the question.....here it is again...

Do you think he should get a new appeal trial if he appeals??

cheers

Rather hypocritical of you, ol' chap.

18 minutes ago, lazarus said:

 

Already answered. R e a d t h e w o r d s.

At least Lazarus answered in a short and succinct answer, unlike the 100 odd words it took you to explain - twice- that you don't repeat yourself....

Cheers

[Nightcrawler]

It is the job of Chauvin's Defence lawyers to make an appeal of some kind. It was clear at the time of conviction that they would do so. No surprises there. 

Much of the original case has been aired already, and in my mind, a new Jury and a retrial out of state, will likely not change the original verdict, but will cost a lot of time and money. 

They are rather questioning the legal system, rather than the guilt of Chauvin. Perhaps they are hoping for 2nd degree murder charge to be overruled which could greatly reduce his sentence

Regardless of what we may personally think about what has been publicised about the trial proceedings, I suspect that the same evidence would be presented in at a retrial by both Defence and Prosecution. 

For me, this case has been about the improper use of force in this case and perhaps others in the past. As is in many countries, those in public service have a duty to carryout their jobs according to codes of conduct and best practice. We see this in the Police, the NHS, the Military, Fire Service, Financial practices and even Politicians who are brought to task for failing to act within the rules set for them 

I don't think it is a question of whether the victim deserved to die or be treated I the way that he was and he cannot speak from the grave. I don't think that is a question whether all Police are bad either. It is about the level of force that was used during the arrest and whether it was necessary. 

Floyd was arrested by 4 Law Enforcement officers after it was reported that he had used forged bank notes in a local store.  He was taken from his car and keys were removed, so no chance of escape by car. He was brought to the ground and handcuffed as a restraint. He was searched and found to be unarmed. 

Therefore, what occurs to me is that........ 

Firstly he posed no physical threat to the 4 Leo's, so why did one of those Officers (Chauvin) feel it necessary to place his knee across the suspect's neck for 9 minutes when he repeatedly said that he was having breathing difficulties which were ignored??

Video evidence from inside the store, before being arrested does not suggest that Floyd was having breathing difficulties, prior to the arrest. 

I can fully understand in a situation where a suspect is armed, that Officers might open fire to protect themselves and the public. That is generally accepted in the US where both Police and many of the public carry firearms. 

However in This case, that did not happen. No one deserved to die on that fateful day, and certainly not for passing counterfeit Bank notes. 

In my mind, the question is........ Could George Floyd have escaped or assaulted Police officers during the time they were awaiting back up to take him from the scene and be charged?  The answer is clearly No. 

He told Chauvin that he could not breath. This was ignored and consequently he died as a result of lack of oxygen. 

Had this not happened, then Floyd would still be alive and probably charged and convicted of handling counterfeit money or whatever the actual crime is described. 

Chauvin chose not to testify. Therefore, if he felt that the steps he took were justified then could have explained that to the court. He did not. 

It is easy to make assumptions as to what was going through his mind at the time and what led him to kneel on the suspect's neck but we simply don't know, and or whether it could be justified. 

Then....... There will be a trial of the other 3 Officers. Should that be delayed??? Will they throw Chauvin under the bus to save their own skins? Who knows? 

We don't know for sure whether there will be a retrial

My opinions are not based on Race or preconceived notions of the US Police force, but what I have read from the Trial Proceedings,along with the question of what is considered to necessary and unnecessary force in this instance 

 

 

[lazarus]

hmmm...

The Chauvin team’s attempts for a retrial are going nowhere
There is less than meets the eye with juror number 52

https://spectator.us/topic/derek-chauvin-team-attempts-retrial-going-nowhere/

... Mitchell, it turns out, attended the event observing the anniversary of Martin Luther King’s march on Washington in the district this past August 28. This week a photo of Mitchell at the march turned up on social media featuring him wearing a t-shirt sporting the slogan ‘Get your knee off our necks’ and declaring ‘BLM’. The photograph suggests that Mitchell was an unlikely candidate to have served as an impartial juror in Chauvin’s case.

Despite (bad) appearances, I think there is less here than meets the eye. I covered the trial from jury selection through the verdict. My notes on Mitchell’s responses to Chauvin’s lawyer Eric Nelson during jury selection reflect Mitchell’s view of the case at that point. He wondered why officers didn’t interrupt Chauvin’s conduct before Floyd’s death. I think that was a fair question.

My notes further reflect Mitchell’s ‘very favorable view’ of Black Lives Matter and his statement supporting the view that racially discriminatory misconduct takes place ‘well beyond what the media can report’. Mitchell also stated during jury selection that he wanted to serve on the jury because he ‘would love to be a part of this historic case’.

If Mitchell’s previous statements didn’t raise a red flag for Nelson, I thought the last statement should have. Each of these statements is consistent with Mitchell’s t-shirt. I think Nelson exercised poor judgment accepting him as a juror on the case...

[KWA]

2 hours ago, lazarus said:

I think Nelson exercised poor judgment accepting him as a juror on the case...

I've not been following it, but did he have any appeals or other choices left by the time Mitchell was appointed?

[lazarus]

Just now, KWA said:

I've not been following it, but did he have any appeals or other choices left by the time Mitchell was appointed?

That was in the jury selection process prior to the trial.

He could have objected and dumped Mitchell as a juror for any number of reasons. Happens all the time.

Some have speculated he let him sit on the jury to have grounds for a new trial or appeal later.

Defense lawyers don't always play by the rules. It's mostly an act.

[lazarus]

The "cops who murder" that keeps on giving...stay tuned.

4 ex-cops indicted on US civil rights charges in Floyd death

https://www.sfchronicle.com/news/article/3-ex-cops-involved-in-Floyd-death-appear-in-16159501.php

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) — A federal grand jury has indicted the four former Minneapolis police officers involved in George Floyd’s arrest and death, accusing them of willfully violating the Black man’s constitutional rights as he was restrained face-down on the pavement and gasping for air.

A three-count indictment unsealed Friday names Derek Chauvin, Thomas Lane, J. Kueng and Tou Thao.

Specifically, Chauvin is charged with violating Floyd's right to be free from unreasonable seizure and unreasonable force by a police officer. Thao and Kueng are also charged with violating Floyd’s right to be free from unreasonable seizure, alleging they did not intervene to stop Chauvin as he knelt on Floyd's neck. All four officers are charged for their failure to provide Floyd with medical care...

[nampla69]

If only he had just got quietly out of the car as he was politely asked to do and got a ticket for a fake bill.

So many human lives ruined and destroyed ........ OK if only another cop not that vile Chauvin had answered that call so many ifs ..... if only Lane and Keung had just got off when he was handcuffed .......... sad sad sad.

[roobob]

1 hour ago, nampla69 said:

If only he had just got quietly out of the car as he was politely asked to do and got a ticket for a fake bill.

So many human lives ruined and destroyed ........ OK if only another cop not that vile Chauvin had answered that call so many ifs ..... if only Lane and Keung had just got off when he was handcuffed .......... sad sad sad.

It seems he got out of the car. Was actually put in the Police car to take him to the station but resisted and wanted out.

The bloke resisted arrest.... that has seemed to be overlooked....he was restrained.... it seems to me here the big loss is the Police who show up every day and put their lives on the line for the safety of the general public.

Seems this is another example of where a criminal has more rights than the arresting police and the people they look after...the general public.

I wonder how much compensation the pregnant lady got for the crime committed against her by Floyd. Maybe if she had said that Floyd wore a police uniform at the time she would now be laughing.

cheers

 

Edited May 7, 2021 by roobob

[roobob]

2 minutes ago, roobob said:

 

 

 

Double post.

Edited May 7, 2021 by roobob

[lazarus]

1 hour ago, nampla69 said:

If only he had just got quietly out of the car as he was politely asked to do and got a ticket for a fake bill.

So many human lives ruined and destroyed ........ OK if only another cop not that vile Chauvin had answered that call so many ifs ..... if only Lane and Keung had just got off when he was handcuffed .......... sad sad sad.

The cops could have issued a citation / notice to appear, and went on their way. They do it all the time.

Chauvin had a chip on his shoulder...maybe too many years patrolling the hood. Wanted to f*ck someone up. Maybe had a fight with Mrs. Minnesota before his shift...who knows? He'll have 15-20 years to think about it.

There are no excuses for what he did, or for the other cops standing by.

Edited May 7, 2021 by lazarus

[forqalso]

6 hours ago, nampla69 said:

If only he had just got quietly out of the car as he was politely asked to do and got a ticket for a fake bill.

So many human lives ruined and destroyed ........ OK if only another cop not that vile Chauvin had answered that call so many ifs ..... if only Lane and Keung had just got off when he was handcuffed .......... sad sad sad.

 

 

Where’s the “politely asked” part? The only “please” and “sir” I heard was from George Floyd. Has there ever been any evidence presented that Floyd produced the fake twenty or he did receive it from someone?

[nampla69]

9 hours ago, forqalso said:

 

 

Where’s the “politely asked” part? The only “please” and “sir” I heard was from George Floyd. Has there ever been any evidence presented that Floyd produced the fake twenty or he did receive it from someone?

It's all as clear as daylight on the CCTV. Little fat guy with the red baseball cap who refused to testify (took the 5th) is seen giving it to GF. He had tried to pass off a similar fake note earlier that day as well, The clerk in the store a young 20 year old black lad also gave very detailed testimony at the start of the trial about accepting the note. He then later went outside and asked GF to come back in to the store. GF was getting high in the car and also sleeping according to the woman who was in the back of the car who also gave testimony. Then the first two cops arrived. Seemed fairly calm and reasonable from the tape. 

[Kathmandu]

3 hours ago, nampla69 said:

It's all as clear as daylight on the CCTV. Little fat guy with the red baseball cap who refused to testify (took the 5th) is seen giving it to GF. He had tried to pass off a similar fake note earlier that day as well, The clerk in the store a young 20 year old black lad also gave very detailed testimony at the start of the trial about accepting the note. He then later went outside and asked GF to come back in to the store. GF was getting high in the car and also sleeping according to the woman who was in the back of the car who also gave testimony. Then the first two cops arrived. Seemed fairly calm and reasonable from the tape. 

Where is the little fat guy? I don't see him in this clip.

[Evil Penevil]

2 hours ago, Kathmandu said:

Where is the little fat guy? I don't see him in this clip.

He is seen in other body-cam and surveillance footage.  Here Morries (also spelled Maurice or Morris) Hall is probably handing over the $20 bill to GF, although it is unclear.  

 

15 hours ago, forqalso said:

Has there ever been any evidence presented that Floyd produced the fake twenty or he did receive it from someone?

Using a counterfeit bill is a state misdemeanor, but producing a fake bill is a Federal rap with much more serious consequences. That's one of the reasons Hall, a career criminal, refused to testify at the GF trial.   There's background in the video below.  Hall isn't the type of guy ex-con George Floyd should have hanging around with. GF's choice of friends doesn't give any support to the notion he was trying to go straight and get his life back on track.

 

Edited May 8, 2021 by Evil Penevil

[nampla69]

That woman in the clip is a piece of work too when she gave evidence. Obviously no stereotyping of the angry black woman why would anyone possibly think that ??? She was in the back of the car and with fatty drug dealer on the pavement.

 

[forqalso]

2 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

He is seen in other body-cam and surveillance footage.  Here Morries (also spelled Maurice or Morris) Hall is probably handing over the $20 bill to GF, although it is unclear.  

 

Using a counterfeit bill is a state misdemeanor, but producing a fake bill is a Federal rap with much more serious consequences. That's one of the reasons Hall, a career criminal, refused to testify at the GF trial.   There's background in the video below.  Hall isn't the type of guy ex-con George Floyd should have hanging around with. GF's choice of friends doesn't give any support to the notion he was trying to go straight and get his life back on track.

 

Do the crimes of use or producing a counterfeit bill carry the death sentence without trial?  Use of a counterfeit bill carries no penalty if there was no intent to commit fraud.  GF could have received it somewhere down the line and had no idea it was fake,  but we’ll probably never know.  
It doesn’t matter what Hall was up to, having him for a friend might be a violation of probation or parole and maybe it could put one back in jail for VOP; but again, not a crime that carries the death penalty without trial.

If Hall’s refusal to testify means something to you, what does Chauvin’s refusal to testify say?

Edited May 8, 2021 by forqalso

[Horizondave]

I don't pop in here much but saw this the other day, maybe just a video to inform certain people how to behave when stopped by the police. Chris Rock is the provider of the tips and this was produced many years ago, I think 2007.

Disclaimer: this is just a video of interest, it is not a comment on the death of GF. 

 

[nampla69]

39 minutes ago, forqalso said:

If Hall’s refusal to testify means something to you, what does Chauvin’s refusal to testify say?

Errmmm .. to anyone with 2 matching neurones could it be that they are both guilty as f**k and have lots to hide.

Still don't get Chauvin's ( means knobhead in French) lack of testimony. Fatty drug dealer and his angry crack mate I get they sold GF a combination Fentanyl and crystal meth that was not the wisest thing for St George of Minneapolis to ingest at his age. But guess that is my 'white privilege" speaking   ......pile of stinking horse shit IMHO. 

Why do you American boys put up with this Robyn di Angelo crock of as BM Larry Detroits finest would say rat shit.